Banned by game provider (card counting)

ColdOne

Novato

Alemanha

há 2 anos

OriginalTradução

Hi everybody!

It's my first post here and i hope this is the right section for this thread!

Anyway, let me explain you m'y dilemma

Let's say i get banned in an online casino for card counting at blackjack live dealer game. At that point will i be banned only by that particular casino or by the entire game provider itself too? (Let's take Evolution as an example here as it is the biggest game provider)

In other words could i access another blackjack table of that provider with another casino site or they would somehow recognize me and don't let me enter their lobby?

Wich leads to another question: What kind of informations game providers have about us? Only IP adress or also personal details when a person is flagged as an Advantage Player?

Thanks in advance to everyone for the answers!

Daniel

ColdOne

Head of Community & Social Media

ColdOne

há 2 anos

OriginalTradução

Hi, even though it generally remains a secret, I'm sure that game providers have their own statistics about players. I don't believe the game provider would ban you (I don't even think it could be done easily), but they can flag you and possibly send the info to the casino where you register and start playing Evo games.

Then it would be up to the casino. They could just monitor your gameplay and decide whether they let you continue playing or close your account.

Editado pelo autor há 2 anos

ColdOne

Daniel

Novato

Alemanha

Daniel

há 2 anos

OriginalTradução

Thanks a lot for your answer!

You are right, it's a kinda obscure topic.

So do the process would be:

1) Player get caught by the casino

2) The casino inform the game provider and give to them all the advantage players details( Name, surname, address, etc)

3) The casino put this info in his "data base" and shares it to every casino they work with

Am i right?

I'm sure that if casinos are told by their game provider that a certain player is playing with an advantage, 99% of the times they would defenitely not let him play at all. And this would in fact result in being banned by almost every online live table if you get caught counting at an evolution table even if it's only the first time.

Daniel

ColdOne

Head of Community & Social Media

ColdOne

há 2 anos

OriginalTradução

Actually, when it comes to live casino games, it's usually the game provider who flags the player first and informs the casino. The providers have systems that can detect certain betting patters. So when it happens, they usually inform the casino where the player played the game.

But the cases are different. Sometimes, the player wins a lot so the casino does their own internal check and sometimes even if they don't find anything, they ask the provider to take a look.

ColdOne

Daniel

Novato

Alemanha

Daniel

há 2 anos

OriginalTradução

Thanks a lot again for your answer. It's very interesting and enlightening

Maybe with you expérience you can answers to me another question

I just learned that some casinos share the same live tables with others sites

At this point i wonder: if i log into one of those tables at the same time using 2 different casinos(but both with my identity)will the game provider know that i am sitting at the same table, but logging throught 2 different sites since he knows every player information? And btw would that be a violation of T&c?

Daniel

ColdOne

Head of Community & Social Media

ColdOne

há 2 anos

OriginalTradução

I'm not 100% sure, but I'd say the provider should know it's you, because they should recognize that the bets are made from the same device, IP address etc.

On the other hand, if you wouldn't do any low risk bets (for example take bonuses on both accounts in different casinos, bet on RED using one account and betting on BLACK with the other account, then it shouldn't be against TCs that are generally used by casinos). For example when it comes to blackjack, it's very common that the same player can take multiple spots at the table so the player can play more hands at a time. So why couldn't you sit at the same table using 2 different casino accounts...

The good casino should always ask a simple questions: Did the player get any unfair advantage by using 2 casino accounts? If the answer is NO, then there shouldn't be an issue.

ColdOne

Daniel

Novato

Alemanha

Daniel

há 2 anos

OriginalTradução

Thanks again for taking the time to answer me

I totally agree with you. It would not generate any unfair advantage so it should be allowed in every reliable and honest casino

But i was asking that question for another reason: in fact i was thinking the card counter could just jump from casino to casino counting cards and never spotted if he keeps his sessions short enough in every casino. But this would be possible only if the game provider doesn't know it's the same player playing from different sites( and so being able to track his betting pattern through the different casinos). If evolution only sees the IP address and the device it can easily be changed by changing device and using vpn but if from the beginning they have access to personal details of every player(name, surname, address,etc) then the card counter will have a hard time. In your opinion the online casinos fournish the game provider all those personal info from the beginning about every player or they just see the IP address and player's location and then if the counter get spotted they unveil all his info to them?

By the way i found an interesting interview with a COO of a large game aggregator. During the interview the COO said that the game providers doesn't know who the player IS. They only receive a "transaction ID" and the 2 digits country code of the players locations. But i don't know how much it's reliable

file

Here is the link if you want to read it:

https://inpractise.com/articles/evolution-gaming-b2b-aggregators-and-regulatory-outlook

Daniel

ColdOne

Head of Community & Social Media

ColdOne

há 2 anos

OriginalTradução

I also don't believe the game provider's have your name. They only see the ID. So the information should be legit. When it comes to card counting, you'd definitely face 2 issues.

1st one is simple - when you leave the table in a casino where you count cards, you should make sure that the spot at the table remains empty until you manage to join it from another casino.

2nd issue is following - live casino providers try to defend against card counting since they know it could be done quite easily from your home. In history, you could see casinos where blackjack was played with maybe 2-3 decks of cards, but when it comes to online casinos, they usually play with 6-8 decks and they change the shoe with decks completely after about 3-4 decks are used.

When you play with 3 decks, count the cards, there's only 1 deck remaining and you know there should be many high cards, you simply know it. But when you count 2-3 decks, but there are still 4-6 remaining, the leverage you gained is quite low since you counted only the smaller part of the decks and there are still many remaining.

You know, card counting is extremely easy, especially when you use a software for it so if it could be simply used in online casinos, they wouldn't even offer the option to play blackjack there.

Editado pelo autor há 2 anos

ColdOne

Novato

Alemanha

há 2 anos

OriginalTradução

You are right. Card counting in online casinos comes with many difficulties and challages. And gaming conditions are horrible for an advantage player compared to brick & mortar casinos

But i do it just for fun, knowing that's worth not a lot more that a couple of bucks per hour.

And i was scared of being banned by all online casinos because Evolution could eventually track my betting pattern through all the different sites. But if everything we discussed is true then i feel relieved

Thanks again for taking the time to answer to me

Banned by game provider (card counting)

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