LevelUp Casino - O jogador contesta a dedução sobre os termos do bônus.

$641.98 was deducted from my account, due to falsified bonus terms regarding bonus level 4 fs.. Inwhich they claim that I exceeded the max win from the freespins which is $50, but I only won $28.. This bonus also has no max cashout/turn over when completing the wagering requirements, inwhich I did.. They then proceeded to make up other excuses and are rejecting my request for a refund.. $641.98 was won on progressive freespins on the slot mummyland treasures.. Not on the bonus level 4 fs slot which was Japanese coin.. Attached I have proof of previous conversations and account information regarding the bonus and terms.. Everytime I ask them to provide any proof of exceeding the bonus terms, considering I completed the wager requirements without fault, but they would not provide deduction time and slot, nor bet exceeding max win amount

Dear Traps323,

Thank you very much for submitting your complaint. I’m sorry to hear about your problem. Please allow me to ask you a few questions, so I can understand the whole situation completely.

• Let me clarify, did you finish wagering for a free bonus and then continue playing?
• Has your balance ever been moved from a bonus balance to real money?
• Would you mind requesting and sending us your complete game history? My email address is petronela.k@casino.guru.

I hope we will be able to help you to resolve this issue as soon as possible. Thank you in advance for your reply.

Best regards,

Petronela

Please be aware: At Casino.Guru, we never ask for your casino account password. While we may request information, we never seek access to your account. Please refrain from sharing your password with any third party. We primarily communicate through official threads, occasionally via email for requested supporting evidence or relevant communication.

Yes, I completed wager and continued to play, with real funds, I reached a balance of $2000, when the deduction of $641.98 aud, was made, a few hours later, on mummyland treasures.. The level 4 bonus fs, that I wagered, were allocated for Japanese coin, inwhich I won $28 which does not exceed the assa$50 max fs win.. This bonus also has no max cashout/conversion attached

Thank you very much, Traps323, for providing all the necessary information. I will now transfer your complaint to my colleague Branislav (branislav.b@casino.guru) who will be at your assistance. I wish you the best of luck and hope to see your problem being resolved to your satisfaction in the near future.  

How.lkng is this going to take and why has levelup failed to reply to any of this?

Hello, Traps323,

I am sorry to hear about your trouble, and I am sorry for the delay.

From now on, I will assist you with your complaint. The casino did not fail to respond. I am the one who should invite the casino representative to the thread if I consider it necessary. This has not been done yet.

I reviewed the game logs you sent to my colleague Petronela. Although it is not completely user-friendly, I edited it to a better readable form, and I will send it to your email after I finish writing this post. Before I invite the casino to the thread (if it is needed at all), I have a few questions for you.

Do I understand correctly that the disputed winnings were won from FS attached to the fourth welcome deposit bonus? If so, how did you please find out that there is no maximum cashout for the FS?

This is what I found on the casino website regarding the deposit and FS in question (the same is stated in their general bonus Ts&Cs):

And this is how I see it in your game history - although you received FS in the amount of 28.88 NZD (those were not winnings of 28.88 NZD from FS, but they were your FS in the amount of 28.88 NZD which should have been played), you played with them, but the disputed/deducted winnings were accumulated with those FS, not after you played them but during playing with them. However, these FS were subject to the terms in the screenshot above. They say there is no max cashout for the bonus money, but we are talking about FS attached to the bonus which have a 50 NZD maximum win cap. It means that you could not win more than 50 NZD from those FS. If you look at the edited game logs that will be in your inbox in a while, you can see that I highlighted a few important rows there (starting with row 5537 when FS were activated) and the important values are highlighted in orange colour there. You can clearly see that your balance was 50 NZD higher than it was before FS were played - the maximum win amount from FS was left in your balance, in accordance with the casino's Bonus Terms and Conditions/bonus specific Terms and Conditions.

Is this explanation and the edited game logs enough for you to understand the situation, or is there anything else I could help you with?

Can you please provide me with a link or a screenshot of the rules which state that there is no maximum win limit for FS used? Unfortunately, I am afraid if there was no such a rule on the casino website, I cannot see any issue here at all, and we would not need to invite the casino to the thread.

First of all, these fs were not the fourth deposit bonus spins.. These were part of the loyalty program level 4 bonus.. Inwhich I received 50fs.. And I played these 50fs on Japanese, and won $28.88 from them.. Inwhich I proceeded to wager on other slots with winnings I had already accumulated before playing the fs



As shown in the levelup casino loyalty program

Alright, Traps323, thank you for the additional information. It looked like those FS were a part of the 4th deposit bonus since, as shown in my screenshot above, it is activated by a code "LVL4". In addition, I am sorry for the misleading information - if you opened the edited version of your game logs, you could see that no rows/cells were highlighted, as I mentioned. It was not saved correctly due to the file format (.csv)...

However, your screenshot likely does not relate to the loyalty FS either. As I can see, there is information about wagering 30x in your screenshot and the maximum amount you can win of 100 NZD. But in the game logs and another of your screenshots, it seems the wagering was 10x and the max win was 50 NZD. In addition, it still makes sense that you received 28.88 winnings from level 4 loyalty, earned the disputed winnings during the wagering of those funds, and that they were simply deducted from your balance upon meeting the wagering requirements of 10x the winnings from those FS.

In your game logs, you can clearly see that your balance was increased by 28.88, then there was the wagering of those winnings (all rows with "Level 4 FS" value in column "Bonus Issue"), and at the end of wagering, everything over maximum cashout of 50 NZD was deducted from your balance. There was 1299.24 in your balance before 28.88 was credited to your balance and 1349.24 after the wagering requirements were met.

In addition, I really do not know how you figured out that you wagered any of the winnings from FS with the funds you accumulated before FS were used. It does not work like that at all. What does your previously accumulated balance have to do with FS? For better understanding, I recommend you rather imagine that there was no balance at the time the FS were activated. Then you simply (as under normal circumstances) played a no-deposit bonus with the maximum win limit of 50 NZD, which was applied upon meeting the wagering requirements.

I am not sure if I overlooked something, but honestly, I cannot see any issue here. So, let's ask the casino for the details and explanation.

Dear LevelUp Casino team,

Could you please provide us with an explanation of the player's situation in more detail and put everything in perspective?

It would be also great if you could provide us with the exact rules for the Level 4 FS and a way how to find them because I think no correct rules applied for those FS have been shared in this thread yet.

Thank you in advance for providing the information.

So you are telling me that, if I exceeded max win of $50, then I would receive $50 and not $28.88, right? And you also believe that, this bonus level 4 fs has a max win of $50, with wager requirements that are 10x the winnings , clearly exceeding $50 no matter the fs winnings amount? That doesnt make sense

Let me tell you what makes sense, is this.. Level 4 loyalty program 50fs.. Max fs win $50.. My fs winnings, $28.88.. Clearly not exceeding max win.. Wager requirements, 10x bonus amount, which amounts to $288.. With no max cashout attached.. Which means anything won, with the fs winnings, are withdrawable once wager is met

There is no point in having a max win of $50, and wager req

Requirements of 10x the bonus fs winnings.. Which clearly exceeds $50.. Therefore the no max cashout attached, is applied during wagering of winnings..And max win of $50 is only applied to amount won during the fs.. MAX WIN DOES NOT MEAN MAX WINNINGS.. I REPEAT, DOES NOT

I wrote what I saw in your game logs, and that it does not correspond with the screenshots of the rules you provided. After you received 28.88, you started the wagering, and the wagering requirements were met. At that point, your balance was 50 NZD higher than before receiving 28.88 (everything over 50 NZD was deducted from the winnings). So, some limit of 50 NZD was applied upon meeting the wagering requirements. Maybe it could have been a mistake/system error... Therefore, I did not close the case and invited the casino to the thread so it could explain the situation and provide the details and/or applied rules.

However, it does not matter what you think, but what rules were applied, how it is explained there, and how the casino apply them. Different casinos consider max win or max cashout amounts differently, so we definitely need the explanation and details from the casino.

Let's wait for the casino's response.

Those gaming logs have obviously been manipulated and tempered with by the casino, as you can clearly see, the timestamps do not add up, as shown at the top, level 4 bonus is active for mummylands but not cash pig? But I played cash pig before mummylands

Also, bonus loyalty program terms and conditions are as shown here, please note the n ok max cashout. And also the note max fs win, which does not mean max winnings 

So you played FS in Cash Pig ("Level Up Cash Pig" in your screenshot) but wagered the winnings from FS on Mummyland Treasures. What is unclear?

I do not think anything was manipulated.

Where does it say fs on cash pig? Fs were on Japanese coin.. Seems like you're more enabling, rather than genuinely helping me..

You obviously sound like another brainless chump try your best to find any flaw and excuse to defy the facts.. Even when the proof is right there.. You're either clueless to the fact, or you're just enabling by turning a blind eye to their misdemeanors.. So you can close this case, because its obviously pointless, when you're trying to deny facts and make up falsified information.. You need to quit, because you're retarded asf mate

Dear Traps323,

Thank you for your meaningful opinion and information. However, I do not understand what are you talking about and hope you are kidding.

"Where does it say fs on cash pig?" - I commented on YOUR previous post. Please read your own posts again if you do not remember what you wrote. I am really sorry that I do not have time to go through all your meaningful posts full of discrepancies, misleading and/or made-up information (such as the casino manipulated the data - yes, sure, due to a few hundred, which otherwise would ruin the whole casino if they left them on your balance...).

Instead of ignoring you, I tried to understand and comment on your posts, but it is very hard. Basically, I only commented on the data (game logs) provided or commented on your posts. I informed you several times that we had to wait for the casino's response. You, instead of waiting, keep replying and giving more and more irrelevant and misleading information. I am really not sure who fits the description from your last post in this case.

"proof is right there" - evidence (game logs) is contradictory to your claims and screenshots. Without the casino's response, we cannot find out what happened, and if it was a mistake/system error...

Despite your last post, I decided to give it a chance anyway and wait for the casino's response. Your post looks a bit impulsive, and we should calm down. It would be a pity to close it without even looking at the casino's response.

However, of course, we do not force anyone to use our services (for free) to resolve their issues. If you are not interested in our services anymore, feel free to inform me about it. I can close the case and give space to another player/complaint. There are many. Just confirm it, and I will process it.

On the other side, once you calm down, please, just wait for the casino's response. But I would highly appreciate it if you could stop using similar language as was used in your last post. Otherwise, the complaint will be closed/rejected for a different reason. You can take it as the first but also the last warning.

If we can proceed in resolving the complaint - thank you for your patience and understanding. Let's wait for the casino's response.

First off, I would like to apologize for my inappropriate comments made, It is frustrating..

But if you look closely, this information regarding bet history, says that cash pig has NO level 4 fs attached, and that the level 4 loyalty quest fs were activated on mummyland treasures, which is completely false..

The level 4 fs were allocated for Japanese coin..

This also shows that my balance at the time of level 4 fs on mummylands was $1328, which is also false, as I took a screenshot after the level 4 fs winnings of $28 on Japanese coin, which also shows the time top right corner and balance bottom right corner

I dont mean to mislead you, considering most of the information provided are screenshots, regarding my levelup casino account, and the information as shown on their system..

And I doubt that their system information would be misleading right?

So we will wait for a response, as I would expect them to provide the same account information that I have..

Dear Traps323 and Casino Guru Team,

Thank you for reaching out to us!

We would like to provide more information about your recent inquiries regarding your bonus winnings from Level 4.

To begin, we would like to bring more clarity regarding the terms of this bonus. Recently, our Loyalty Program underwent updates, specifically on April 10th. Now, this program has different bonuses and conditions regarding redemption and maximum winnings. Unfortunately, you won’t find the relevant rule on the website at this time.

However, we have confirmation regarding the old terms for this bonus, which you can review: https://prnt.sc/aKgP3Gm009c1

It is also important to note that you contacted customer support regarding your inquiry before our program was updated, and our agents provided you with accurate information, stating that the maximum win from the bonus for Level 4 would be 50 NZD. You can check this in your chat history or we can provide the relevant evidence that can be checked through the link: https://prnt.sc/I61xrs-D9u6J

Besides, we want to mention that you won 28 NZD from playing free spins in the game Japanese Coin: Hold The Spin. You can check this in your profile under the bonus history section: https://levelupcasino.com/promotions

Afterwards, it seems that you used your winnings to wager in the game Mummyland Treasures and won a total of 691.29 NZD. However, please keep in mind that according to our terms and conditions, the maximum win from this bonus is 50 NZD. As a result, the system automatically deducted the excess amount, which was 641.98 NZD.

At the time, your balance was 1299.24 NZD. With the bonus winnings of 28.88 NZD, your total balance reached 1328.12 NZD. Once you completed the bonus wagering requirements, your balance was 1991.22 NZD. After the deduction of 641.98 NZD, your balance settled at 1349.24 NZD.

We have thoroughly reviewed the deduction process and it appears to be accurate. However, if you need further clarification, please refer to the Bet History statement we provided earlier.

We appreciate your understanding and patience.

Kind regards,

LevelUp Casino Team

Note maximum win.. Does not mean maximum winnings

Thank you, LevelUp Casino team, for the clarification. I have only a few last questions.

In your screenshot of the rules that are not available on the casino website anymore, I can see the next rule "14. No max cashout is attached."

Where were those rules available before, and in which section? Is it possible to find the complete rules that applied before April 10? What was that no max cashout related to, please?

What happens if a player wins more than $50 from such FS? Are the winnings capped at the point when the FS are spent, or is it simply moved to the player's balance (and it could be more than $50), where they have to be wagered, and only then it is capped by the max win/max cashout amount (upon meeting the wagering requirements)?

The no max cashout rule applied to the old loyalty program, inwhich I reached level 4, obtained the level 4 fs and am currently disputing..

The rules were changed as soon as the new loyalty program commenced, from the date of April 10th 2024 UTC

My screenshots here show the email I received April 11th 2024 NZT, April 10th 2024 UTC.. Regarding the new loyalty program and

Yes, but it looks like the "no max cashout", if it is like it is for other bonuses at the casino, is valid only for no-deposit cash, not FS, or that it applies after continuing playing with fully wagered winnings cleansed from everything exceeding the "maximum win" amount. Basically, I thought that since the beginning, and it makes sense like that.

Let's wait for the casino's response and clarification.

Please note, that it says no max cashout directly after max fs win.

Also note, that the no max cashout applies to both, the cash bonuses and the fs bonuses

Cash bonus- Bonus funds with wager requirements

Fs bonus winnings- Bonus funds with wager requirements

Max fs win- Is the capped amount when playing the freespins e.g 50fs with a max win of $50

Dear Traps323 and Casino Guru Team,

Thank you for contacting us regarding your situation. We appreciate your feedback and want to ensure complete transparency and understanding in addressing the issue.

We would like to clarify the conditions regarding this bonus. The maximum win refers to the highest amount that can be won using the bonus. If this amount is exceeded after fulfilling the wagering requirements, the system will automatically deduct the excess funds.

The maximum cashout is the limit on how much can be withdrawn if winnings exceed the maximum win amount. In this case, any excess winnings will be deducted upon withdrawal request if the player’s balance exceeds the specified maximum cashout.

After reviewing the situation, it appears that the player exceeded the maximum win condition, resulting in the remaining balance being deducted by the system upon completing the bonus wagering.

We would also like to mention that the rules for this bonus were previously available in the LOYALTY section, which could be accessed from the top of the website: https://prnt.sc/Qrl_NLoAlABY

However, as we have previously communicated, the Loyalty program was updated on April 10th, and the conditions displayed on the website have changed. As proof, we have provided a screenshot of the rules that were shared with the player in previous chats before the Loyalty program update:  https://prnt.sc/aKgP3Gm009c1

If you have any further questions or require additional assistance, please do not hesitate to reach out to our customer support team. We are here to address your concerns and provide any necessary clarifications.

Hope for your understanding and patience!

Kind regards,

LevelUp Casino Team

$28 was won using the bonus which did not exceed $50 max win

Any winnings won whilst using the bonus applied to max cashout, inwhich there was non attached

Thank you very much, LevelUp Casino Team, for all your help and cooperation in resolving the matter.

Dear Traps323,

In the meantime, I discussed the complaint internally with the team, and we agreed that there is nothing we could dispute about the casino system or process around bonuses. It is basically as I tried to explain earlier, which the casino confirmed by their last 2 posts.

Unfortunately, after gathering all the necessary information and details, we concluded your complaint is unjustified, and will be closed accordingly. The casino system worked correctly and in accordance with the terms and conditions valid at the time you used the bonus in question. As I mentioned above, different casinos consider max win or max cashout amounts differently, and it is industry standard that winnings from no-deposit FS are usually limited by wagering requirements and maximum win/cashout amount, applied upon meeting the wagering requirements or requesting a withdrawal. Understandably, a player can win a maximum of 50 NZD from such free spins, and we accept it if we are talking about a bonus (free money), especially no-deposit ones. If you continued playing with the 50$, after meeting the WRs, you would not be limited anymore (no maximum cashout), which is not common in all online casinos.

For better imagination, let's take a simple example. You have 0 balance and receive 20 classic FS as a no-deposit bonus, as in any other good online casino, with a maximum cashout limit of 50$. You spend FS and accumulate $30 winnings from them, the only balance you have. You continue with wagering, to meet the wagering requirements, and you reach out 100$. However, as usual and standard, the maximum limit is applied upon meeting the wagering requirements, and the balance is decreased to the maximum amount of 50$. Then you can do anything you want with 50$, since from this moment, they are considered a real money (withdrawable) balance. Some casinos do not let players continue playing with such funds, and simply anything over 50$ is removed from a balance, even if players continue playing after meeting the wagering requirements (we do not agree with that). That is the main point that I would like to point out. Although you talked about the difference between the maximum win limit, winnings limit, and cashout limit, it is only playing with words in this case. According to the rules valid for the FS you used and the winnings you wagered, you were allowed to receive a maximum of 50$, which you got, and you could have further used them as you wanted. Standard situation and process. There is nothing to solve, and I believe everything is clear now.

In the future, I strongly recommend discussing unclear rules with casinos' Customer Support representatives before accepting them.

I am sorry we were not able to help you with this one, but please, do not hesitate to contact us in the future, if you run into any issues with this or any other casino. We are here to help.

If you are not satisfied with the complaint solution, I recommend you consult the gambling authority that the casino is regulated by.

In case of any questions, feel free to write to me at branislav.b@casino.guru.

Best regards,

Branislav, Casino.Guru